God

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Anyway, to ellusionist and his "perfect" Quran. You have yet to tell me WHY it is perfect, and if you say humans just cant write like it one more time Im never coming back to this thread lol. Unless thats what you want, then Im coming back twice daily until I die haha.

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Damn man im repeating myself over and over and u dont understand .. how old r u anyway lol !

ok i'll tell u why its perfect AGAIN ! ... the Quran is written why long time ago like before 632 AD ... and it tells u .. how the creation starts .. and how the ppl will think in the future and so on ... Example Noah Ark... it was written in the Quran how the story happened .. and where did the Ark ended so it can be a proove of God existance (which the SCIENTISTS discovered in i think 1958 untill now over 100 SCIENTISTS Confirmed that its Noah's ARK)So how can a book that old tells us where the Ark ended and how the creation started and so on.... but also these is alot of other things that prooves that God exists ! ... and its written in a perfect way in grammer and style in arabic .. which nobody can make one chapter like it these days ... so its hardly for a man along that time .. to predict and rigtht those things .. GOT IT !! or u want me to repeat again .. and i hope u wont give me a stupid excuse again .. ! :D



thats the biggest proof that nobody can write like it .. what else u want me to tell u if that u dont understand ..

i think ur just making excuses thats all ... !!

Hmm.

I used to be into relligion in a very big way many years ago. Even studied theology (i think i'm repeating myself).

Anyway, I just want to make it clear. As far as I am aware there has been no reported finding of Noah's Ark in any scientific journal of repute. By repute I mean an independant journal not financed (or owned) by any religious group.

In the main stream christian religions, they all beleive in Noah's Ark and the great Deluge. however one of the premises is that there is no proof of God, and God refuses to prove his extistant. Cause then you would know he exists but you wouldn't have faith in him... The christain faith is based on beleif and faith in the unproven.

I'm not familar with Isam enough to comment on their faith principles, but I thought the matter of faith was very similar to Christianity, which is to have faith in something not proved. To beleive in God based on the marvel of creation, but not from scientific fact.

There is a lot of evidence that some form or cataclysmic event occured in our past. A lot of different independ societies with different beleif systems have stories of a 'great deluge'. However such an event doesn't prove that there is a God. I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that finding Noah's Ark proves this.

No offence intended in my post btw.

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Anyway, I just want to make it clear. As far as I am aware there has been no reported finding of Noah's Ark in any scientific journal of repute. By repute I mean an independant journal not financed (or owned) by any religious group.

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Here u Go ... that answers ur 1st Question :D

1- http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...7_noahsark.html

2- http://www.wyattmuseum.com/noahs-ark-07.htm

3- http://www.arkdiscovery.com/noah's_ark.htm

4- http://news.nationalgeographic.com/k...5/noahark.html

5- http://users.netconnect.com.au/~leedas/noahb.html

6- http://www.najaco.com/literature/articles/.../august2001.htm

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In the main stream christian religions, they all beleive in Noah's Ark and the great Deluge. however one of the premises is that there is no proof of God, and God refuses to prove his extistant. Cause then you would know he exists but you wouldn't have faith in him... The christain faith is based on beleif and faith in the unproven.

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2nd Question:

in Our Quran it Says .. that God Created this world and us .. so we can acknowledge his existance .. because the more that u know God exist the more u gonna fear him .. and try to do good in this world and pray to him.

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There is a lot of evidence that some form or cataclysmic event occured in our past. A lot of different independ societies with different beleif systems have stories of a 'great deluge'. However such an event doesn't prove that there is a God. I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that finding Noah's Ark proves this.

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3rd Question:

The Creator=> It is only logical to believe that before anything was created there had to be a Creator. It is, also, only logical to believe that this Creator had to be an eternal being without beginning or end and that nothing could be like this Creator. It is this Unique Being Whom the Quran calls God the Lord, the Only Supreme Being worthy of worship.

its written in the Quran:

"We (once) sent Noah to his people, and he tarried among them a thousand years less fifty: but the Deluge overwhelmed them while they (persisted in) sin. " 029.014

"But We saved him and the companions of the Ark, and We made the (Ark) a Sign for all peoples!" 029.015

"Then the word went forth: "O earth! swallow up thy water, and O sky! Withhold (thy rain)!" and the water abated, and the matter was ended. The Ark rested on Mount Judi, and the word went forth: "Away with those who do wrong!" 011.044

P.S: Mount Judi what is known as now Mount Ararat or the oppisite side of Mount Ararat in Turkey

SO HOW CAN A HUMEN RIGHT THE QURAN AND THE BOOK IS LIKE BEFORE 634 AD .. AND KNOWS ALL OF THAT !! HE MUST BE A.I. MAYBE LOL !!

... Up until reading ellusionists last like 50 posts I thought I was pretty smart guy. Im 21 by the way. Can someone other than ellusionist please tell me they understand why the Quran is perfect cause none of that shit makes sense. "Its written in a way that no one can write now" so... that either means that everyone whos tried is an idiot, or its an obsolete form of language that no one has actually practiced in centuries... i refer you to Shakespeare, for an example. Simply because its in a vernacular that is no longer being used, does not make it "the perfect word of God". The only way it could be believably the word of god is if it were in such a form of speech that NO ONE could understand it, because, like the vision of god, his language would be incomprehendable to human beings.

I hope, in all you've writtin ellusionist, that you can realize that you, like the bible, have proven nothing more than the gullibility of the general public.

All of your statements are hollow and illogical. You keep saying "its perfect because we cant do it" Just because you keep repeating it doesnt mean its making sense. I can say no a thousand times and it will never mean yes. Get it?

what I love about Noahs ark is that god chose one family to be saved out of all the people in the world. Im sure more than 6 people were "honorable" so what were the rest? sacrifices for the greater good? Shit, god screwed up the first time, and it looks like shit went downhill again... I wonder whats gonna kill all of us... You're right, if I believed in god I would fear him too, hes kind of moody.

PS. I love MetalSkin for being one of the only other people here using logic as an argument. Thank you for knowing more than me lol.

ok lets say that a humen made it ok ? ... wow than that humen is so smart to know bout the future .. or too smart to know how did the Creation begins ? .. i dont know u tell me then ? was a supreme humen that made it ?! wow and he must damn really good to write all of these stories hmmm....and if humens r limited minded ,, lol DAMN how did he know all of this !! isnt that over his limited Mind !! :D

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what I love about Noahs ark is that god chose one family to be saved out of all the people in the world. Im sure more than 6 people were "honorable" so what were the rest? sacrifices for the greater good? Shit, god screwed up the first time, and it looks like shit went downhill again... I wonder whats gonna kill all of us... You're right, if I believed in god I would fear him too, hes kind of moody.

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1st of all this is u got the wrong story .. noah was prophet .. and tried to convince the ppl to believe in God but no one did he tried and tried .. only few believed in him like maybe 8 ppl and his family .. so the ppl screwed them self up by not believing !!

P.S: lol thats ok tabloid believe what u wanna believe we gonna see whose gonna luaghe last when u gonna be in the Grave ! lol then i wonder if there is God what ur excuse gonna be to him ! :D

P.S 2: like u said if u cant answer the Question where did we came from or how the world was created .. and u dont have scientific proof for that lol .. then dont argue ! :D

P.S 3: u cant imagine that there is a God because its over ur limited mind ! :D and u know that humens minds R Limited :D

Unfortunatly none of your links are what I stated I required for evidence about the existance of Noah's Ark. Most of the sites say that there is the possibility of Noah's Ark, and one is about the Turkish government.

None of them are about the publishing of a paper in an independant Scientific Journal about it. None of these claims have been supported by independant means.

But that is beside the point, as I stated, the existance of Noah's Ark does not prove the existance of God, it just gives evidence to a story from those times.

As for your other points, existance based on faith is not proof. Faith alone is not enough to prove existance of something. Nothing you have stated is about proving the existance of a God, only about how you came to your conclusions.

There is a good quote that fails me at this moment. It goes along the lines of:

If someone has come to a belief system not by means of logic, then there is no point in changing their belief based on logic.


I suspect that this thread was started by someone religious that saw this as a way to spread their message.

As for the comment by tabloid about wht is it perfect. Well I have heard this argument before. Its two fold, how can one person write something that predicts the future. The second is, how can someone write something in 'perfect aramaic' or whatever language it is.

Well for the first one, this again is a beleif system. Its opinion based as to whether the bible or any other religious text predicted future events. Just like it is opinion that aliens have abducted people and performed weird sexual experiances. There is no objective evidence, only subjective.

As for the second, it is also a mater of opinion. As they say, you can find any two people to give conflicting opinions about something.

Man its a visitor place now in Turky .. all of these sites Says its Noah's Ark and the scientists say ""We're telling people we're 98 percent sure its Noah's Ark" so u wanna tell the Scientists that they r Wrong .. go ahead make my day lol :D

lloll Thats a Wild opinion than .. for Ppl before 632 A.D .. lol which us now cant predict or give opinions like that !! :D

so ur Telling me the Hole book is a Wild Guess lol !! ok.. :lol:

i wonder how did they guess that the Ark gonna be on the Mountin too ... hmmm..Damn those ppl before 632 A.D were smarter than us now .. lol

Please read what I posted, regardless of whether Noah's Ark has been found or not, that doesn't prove the existance of God.

I am a bit of a history nut, and love reading about these sort of discoveries and claims. And I know that there isn't any proof yet. If there was it would have been reported in a scientific journal. Popular media reports are not enough for proof, otherwise we would all beleive very strange things indeed.

i read what u posted .. and like i said:

lloll Thats a Wild opinion than .. for Ppl before 632 A.D .. lol which us now cant predict or give opinions like that !!

P.S: how bout that u go to Turky and see it by urself ! lol or go search more so u can be sure and by the way the discovery is old so u wont find in nowadays media ! :`)

P.S 2: visitors center just above the ARK opened May 1989 ... so go to Turkey and see it .. i dont think they would do a visitor center for it if there not sure :``)

Did you read what I said? Read my original post. In it i said that regardless of whether the Ark has been found, this is not proof of the existance of a God.

If you wish links I can provide. A quick search provided this one:

http://www.geocities.com/ronwyattsdiscoveries/noah2.htm which in itself links to another one.

The biggest problem with your links is that half of them are about Ron Wyatt, a person with a mission to prove something. The other half are media reports about what Ron has claimed. The popular media don't care about facts, just what sells well, so no need to post them.

Anyway, i'm not going to waste my time trying to find the non religious opinion on the Ark. I have better things to do, like do some gfx. So I think I will now leave this thread alone.

/MetalSkin